Honors new feed (709)

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Honors new feed (709)

Postby lineman71 » Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:08 pm

Let me start by saying I have been feeding Honor for about 5 yrs now. I have always been very happy with it, I would even try to convince others to feed it. Pigs have always done great on it and looked great also. We fed our reserve champ gilt at our county honor. Now I am feeding the new Honor 709 and the pigs love it. But it has made them really loose, Way too runny! They have been on it three weeks and no change. I have 4 on it and 2 on a different feed. The 4 all have the same runny stool and the other 2 dont so I know its the feed. Not happy with the new Honor. I'll probably finish them out on Honor and see how it goes. But if it doesnt get alot better, I'll be changing brands. Has anyone else fed 709?
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby mathemjm » Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:29 pm

almost like an off brown chocolate butterscotch pudding color and consistency for lack of better description is what i have been seeing in mine been on it for 10 days thought would firm up by now
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby Mary-Okie » Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:49 am

About how much do the pigs weigh?
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby emk0311 » Tue Mar 26, 2013 4:10 pm

We also have ran into the same problem here but with the 509 feed. Have been feeding the 509 now to 4 different litters and all have become real loose after transitioning from the 309. The pigs eating this are between 25 and 40 pounds. Never had this problem before with the show chow feeds.
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby kgb » Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:54 pm

Can I ask where (what state) each of you is from? This is unusual and not what we've seen and expect from the feeds. On the 309 to 509 there's a huge difference in medication. It is possible a '"bug" going through is sensitive to CTC and Denagard (309) and not to Lincomycin and Safeguard (509).
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby emk0311 » Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:34 pm

I am located in pennsylvania. Fed the 509 to a couple other litters at the end of january and it worked great. We thought maybe it was just the transitioning from 309 to 509 but we tried some showrite 50 mg on one of the litters and their stools firmed right up. They all are still eating well and look good but just weird that all of them within a day got loose and never firmed back up.
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby Mary-Okie » Wed Mar 27, 2013 8:58 am

KGB,

Why is the 509 only made with Safeguard in it. There is a major jump from 309 to 709 and only feeding a couple of bags of 509 in between isn't going to cut it. Why is there no 20% protein feed (similar to 509) available to feed these pigs up to 75 lbs before transitioning to the 709 feed?

Typically, many are coming off the 309 at 35 lbs and need something to feed up to 75 lbs. I don't think feeding 509 with safeguard in it for that long a period is a good idea. Is it good to feed 509 for 2 to 3 weeks?
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby kgb » Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:38 am

509 is a receiving feed. That's the I formulated it. Linco and Safe-Guard to get newly purchased pigs and breeders sale pigs off to a healthy, parasite free start.

It is the logical step in the program:
209. 12 to 15 lb pigs
309. 15 to 25 lb pigs
509 25 to 50 lb pigs
709. 50 to 100 lb pigs (or to 75 lb heavily muscled pigs)
809. 100 to show (or from 75 to show as above)

Crude protein means liite in comparison to Lysine and other essential amino acids, especially the first 5 limiting amino acids).

709 contains 1.1% lysine. A corn soybean meal feed containing 18% protein usually ends up at 1.0% lysine. 709 feeds more like a 19 - 19.5% crude protein feed.

Now, I visited with one of our Ambassadors who live in Indiana. They have many, many, many litters on both 509 and 709 and have for some time, and they have seen Zero problems described above. I'm nothing saying you aren't seeing these problems but there are other things that can cause theses issues besides feed. The HSC (HONOR Show Chow) 209, 309, and 509 are made at the same plant for the Eastern Cornbelt and NE including PA. ( that Ambassador is feeding products made at the same plant).
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby Mary-Okie » Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:20 am

So how much of the 509 would you recommend feeding. 1 bag/pig? more/less?

We have a sale coming up in about a week and a half and we have the local Purina feed dealer going to be there to offer 509 for sale. I just want to make sure I recommend the right thing.

Our pigs in the sale will be 50 to 80 pounds. So I was planning on saying only 1 bag 509 per pig was needed and then go to the 709. Good plan?
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby rbburg1212 » Thu Mar 28, 2013 6:30 am

I'm interested as well. We are going to pick up our pigs next week. They will be between 30-40 lbs when we get them. My plan was to put them on 509 until they are around 50-60 lbs and then going to 709. Our local Purina dealer needs 1 week lead time on getting feed, so I have to be planning ahead.......
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby kgb » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:49 am

Yes 1 bag of 509 per pig as a receiving feed. This is mostly for the Linco and Safe-Guard. One bag should last about 14 days. That should cover the incubation period of most organisms.

I think we all under estimate how devastating and long lasting the effects can be on young pigs especially if they are co-mingled.

If not HSC or if not 509, then get them medicated somehow: injectable, water soluble etc...
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby lineman71 » Thu Apr 11, 2013 11:10 pm

KGB,
Im in Ohio. The stool is better but still about like mashed potatoes or apple sauce. They have been wormed twice. Once with dectomax and once with safeguard. I didnt feed 509. They're 110-120lbs now.I am planning on feeding 709 up to about 200 lb since they are softer muscled. What do you think?
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby NELAPIGS » Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:58 am

Have you ran any scour check or similar products through them? That has always tightened up stool for me.
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby Gilbertowner » Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:16 am

Louisiana, same problem and son ended up adding 1 can of pumpkin to each feeding and it has helped

Took samples to vet, no worms
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Re: Honors new feed (709)

Postby kgb » Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:08 pm

They are big enough to go onto the 809, you might transition to that feed. It might just fix the loose stools for you. Also are you hand feeding or self feeding?
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